Rukaya Samodien: you guys doing great work for the kids
Rukaya Samodien: good one ladies
Rukaya Samodien: guys you are doing great work
abe: salaams all, MOROCCO with all its beauty and good infrastructure, as in south africa and for that matter egypt tunisia yemen algeria syria libya saudi arabia uae kuwait etc, although billed as a so-called constitutional monarchy, it is in fact an AUTOCRATIC MONARCHY, with all its evils you find elsewhere in similar countries, the 10% elite at the top also have their days numbered
abe: THABIET, boeta BROWN, broers, we will never taste a MEANINGFUL UNITY while tha majority of us collectively look past, ignore, say sweep first on own door-step, trivialise, or condone, etc etc prejudice and oppression firstly among ourselves as an ummah worldwide and secondly even against non-muslims, whether individually or especially from any country ruled by muslims,
latiefc1: WELL THE WAY TO GO IS EVOLUTIONARY CHANGE INSTEAD OF REVOLUTIONARY BREAKDOWN.
Rukaya Samodien: slms sulayla\
abe: LATIEFk, cliches are nice but we have to fit it in with reality and JUSTICE, whats wrong with revolutionary change, why do you couple change with BREAKDOWN? what evolutionary change happened in ALL muslim gulf and north african states? did the people wait? did we wait here in south africa? (except of course we who were satisfied with ulema who told us dont worry with the apartheid boere at least they do this and that and allow us to build masajid and visit the ones we were kicked out from certain areas, by the way, tell any muslim we want EVOLUTIONARY CHANGE IN PALESTINE!! broe, tell us what does the quran and sunnah dictate how we should handle oppression, autocracy, etc?
abe: another disaster in : at least how we handle media last night, when treurnicht or terreblance covered up for apartheid or zioinsts cover up their oppression at least the sound canny if nothing else, .......
abe: at least they sound canny.....
Iekraam Jardine:
Salaamu alykum. It is time that our Muslim brothers and sisters should know the truth about these organisations. I wonder however what is the hidden motive behind this sudden attack on the MJC? Let us call a spade a spade. There is and never will be a 100% gaurantee on any Halaal product, because people have to trust the source.
Last year I was a franchisee of Mr. Video, but got kick out, because I spoke up against this Anti-Muslim organisation and I reported this matter to the National Consumer Council who then started a national investigation into Mr. Vdeo. I still have the derogatory anti-islamic e-mail that came from Mr. Video head office and that was sent to me, another fellow Muslim in the group and circulated in their head office as if it was some kind of a joke.
This same anti-islam group hands out ICSA halaal stickers to franchisees to paste on the Droe Wors and Biltong that we get from head office without any halaal stickers on them. Halaal or Not who knows, but the Islamic Council of South Africa who still did not respond to me after I e-mailed them. I copied the MJC and SANHA as well. Nobody came back to me.
It's all about trust, not fact. Halaal or Not, Allah alone knows? 
radreedy:
Patta is not concerned about Muslims, Halal etc...her job is done. The usual suspects saw and grabbed the opportunity, the ignorant (like sheep), latched on and now we are fighting each other 
abe: salaams IEKRAAM, sorry to hear about what you say is your unfair dismissal, of course some trust we should have, actually a lot, but we pay for and the suppliers pay for a SERVICE ie halaal certificates so the greater part is trust in the CERTIFIERS not so? and we expect the certifiers to BE ON THE JOB THAT THEY HAVE BEEN PAID FOR, not so? even if at any time of day to check compliance, and NOT to be paid by suppliers too as weve heard, thats a conflict of interest not so? yes ALL certifiers must be held to transparency and account but if any others are also guilty of anything that doesnt reduce the guilt of our favoured ones, etc, according to info supplied by MJC only a small percentage of halaal trust income (3.5%?) w as paid to inspectors, why?, so many why's all round, by the way theres NO SUDDEN ATTACK on the mjc, many folk has had it for the mjc and for that matter other orgs too for a long time on this and other issues, also friend you should rather say its NOT ONLY fact halaal or not, but trust TOO, a thinking muslim will never say its NOT about FACT, the quran and sunnah encourages us to ESTABLISH FACT, then comes justice and trust and compassion etc....
abe: salaams RADREEDY, sorry bro youre a bit confused, weve been fighting each other on many issues for a long time, (want examples?), i dont know what you mean by "usual suspects", a suspect is someone who on grounds of some facts is believed to be guilty of, or deemed guilty of until proven, some unethical or unsocial action, in this case the suspects DID NOT GRAB ANY OPPURTUNITY, in fact they shied away until they were forced by circumstances to face the public and then too in a veeery poor manner, making fools of all us muslims, etc etc you know whose the ignorant fools? on day of judgment quran says some of us realing our errors will approach our leaders saying: we followed you, praat voor vir ons, our leaders will say: IF our lord had GUIDED us, then we too would have guided you, ie they were misguided in this world, right now as we converse, in what? many things where we follow them without real proof, accusing people of half and untruths, without real proof, like people who say things then add they dont have to give proof or reasoning etc, its an easy way out, a cop-out, but our creator says what goes around, comes around
radreedy: ABE>for once i agree with you on the definition of something. Thats exactly what i meant by usual suspects. I stand by what I said and no, I'm not confused.
radreedy: Taxi wag............gtg
abe: thanks RADREEDY, ok so you believe that the ulema and others involved with supervising the places they got paid for should be hauled to at least a fact-finding muslim commission? and what about the six ulema/others whom the MJC said were caught stealing public money? do you agree they should be named?
crybaby: salaam voc. 26 jan 2012 . mufti ak . Q&A . mufti was asked a question regarding stunning of animals prior to slautering. part of his answer was that sometimes the animal is dead before actualy being slautered as a result of the stunning....this week a rebroadcast of that Q&A was aired and in this paricular question . the portion where mufti ak mentioned the dead animal , has been removed. i spoke to others who also listened and they concurred. VOC what is happening did you make a mistake or are you twisting the muftis words.
crybaby: same programe same questions . one question diffirently answered . WHERE IS THE VERBATIM ?
crybaby: to put things in better perspective. he , mufti ak said that this was unislamic and that he mentioned this to persons incharge . the response he got was this was a quicker way of slaughtering. in his (mufti) opinion this is cleary a matter of more money in their pockets.
fahiemk: The Muftis answer is merely an opinion from his perspective . Does not mean other opinions is wrong. Just as someone or even all of you would have an opinion on what i just said. If you stun an animal hes definitely not dead.
Rukaya Samodien: slms
crybaby: @fahiemk . please understand what im saying. REBROADCAST SHOULD BE DONE VERBATIM . if not than an anouncement should be made to that effect , otherwise it will be considired as tampered wit. please understand this.
crybaby: lets wait and see if voc will respond to my query
bounca13: Slms to all. Its confirmed by own inspection today, on 3 feb 2012. Simply Asia is not halaal. They are certified by ICSAH but their soya sauce used in food preparation contains alcohol. Its the Kikaman sauce. PLEASE FORWARD TO ALL.
crybaby: omitting part of an answer , potentialy changes the very same answer. of which in this case , is the case.
radreedy: Whoever takes on any responsibility to do anything for anyone must be held accountable for whatever they took responsibility for. period. In this particular case(orion), the MJC has explained and convinced me (at least) that they are not involved in any wrongdoings. There is of course room for improvement. Others are welcome to differ. RE the 6 guys who were found guilty of fraud must face the music. We must remember in Islam there is the principle of pardon, where the victim has the opportunity/right to pardon the culprit or seek compensation.
Iekraam Jardine:
Salaam Brothers and Sisters. Today I have recieved an e-mail from ICSA and they have confirmed that they have NOT certified Mr. Video as halaal. Mr. Video hands out rolls of ICSA halaal stickers to franchisees to stick onto Droe Wors and Biltong themselves. As I said prior to this message that I am an ex-franchisee and I still have the invoices of the Biltong and Droe Wors that we bought from Mr. Video head office. I also have that evil e-mail from Mr. Video head office that attacks Islam. Mr. Video's developer (the guy who sets up new stores) said in an e-mail to us which I have that, "The biltong and dispencer are Halaal and are part of standard store." This means that every according to Mr. Video everyone of their stores through the whole of South Africa sells Halaal biltong and so on. The question is this if ICSA did not certifiy them as Halaal and they use ICSA stickers, then who certified Mr. Video as Halaal and who gave them ICSA stickers? Was Muslims once again tricked into meat that is Not Halaal? And to think that this was done on a National scale. 
Thabiet: Salaam all tramakasie for that info brother Iekraam , so now another below the belt blow to us MUSLIMS and how many more out there are guilty of this practice. I do believe that out of this halal saga will come only good INSHA-ALLAH
simumas: salaams all, sometimes our reasoning is cockeyed, a priori, sometimes we want veeery stringent reasoning and proof from those we disagree with yet are bowled over with flimsy topical tangentical superficial etc "reasons" as "convincing", sometimes we float secondary things whilst :
simumas: while we "forget " the primary principles etc, i see that here
abe: salaams to all, SIMUMAS, i said before stadig oor die klippe, that line of talk is my style, it will get you attacked because youre stepping on many toes .......
abe: the MJC cleverly apologised not for their errors, nor for the muck happening on their watch, but only for the "hurt" suffered by the public for them not " handling" the media better/correctly, after all those SENIORS lied through their teeth putting muslims to shame they fielded young ml carr whose got absolutely nothing to do with halaal trust and was clearly out of his depth, where are the top halaal trust folk like sh titus? now the MJC emphasis is on : the MJC HAS AND WILL NEVER MAKE PORK HALAAL!!! we know that dummies, no real muslim will ever, and : the technicality of MJC DID NOT HALAAL ORION, ONLY AS "IMPORTER" etc etc, well if they USED the funds for the purpose it was collected for they could have had a guy at orion and elsewhere almost 24/7 or at least most of time at ANY time, but ONLY just over 3% of money collected is used for salaries for inspectors? also why should others be paid from this kitty?
abe: wow RADREEDY!! i like your opening gambit regarding responsibility, accountability, ending with the cliche'd "period", then you overturn your established principles laid down with what in the eyes of any objective reader and listener was a DISASTER in PR, SPINNING, MEDIA/ PRESS CONFERENCE etc,
abe: RADREEDY, regarding your "We must remember in Islam there is the principle of pardon, where the victim has the opportunity/right to pardon the culprit or seek compensation.", yes we remember!! but you FORGET: the money IS NOT PRIVATE money, its GHAQ of our CREATOR, BAITUL MAAL, ITS PUBLIC MONEY, the PEOPLE had NO SIGHT OF THE GUILTY ONES, SO HOW CAN WE PARDON THEM? simply put, again as before: in islam when a paid employee especially from ghaq of creator and ummah is guilty of grand theft the FIRST thing is public recall/sacking, THEN recovery of goods/ property/ money etc,THEN punishment and or pardon, thats EXACTLY what sayidina umr did to the GOVERNOR of BAHRAIN, who enriched himself, what principle of islam do you use to overide the former actions with PARDON? DONT IMPOSE YOUR FEELINGS AND SO-CALLED OPINIONS INTO ISLAM!! thats EXACTLY what is referred to when i said above on judgement day some will turn to ulema/ leaders/ imaams and say : we followed you, they will retort : IF our lord had guided us, we would have guided you, ie they too were misguided and misguiding others, IN OUR LIFETIME!!
Thabiet: Salaam all lets not forget to make DUA for UNITY and a FREE PALESTINE INSHA-ALLAH
